bump
DEF and my situation.
DEF seems to be coming up quite a bit in the jeep forums. Unfortunately I have a problem with it too.
Story time:
My JGC has 17k miles on it. Recently I purchased 5 gallons of Peak blue DEF from auto zone and put it in the DEF tank. After about 5 miles of driving I got the message that I used the wrong fluid. Now how could I have put the wrong fluid in I thought...It is the same fluid that I have used all along Even when I had to fill the tank from empty when I bought the vehicle new.
So my trip to the dealership starts and my adventure begins:
The first thing they did was test the fluid. It came out at 35% with their tools which is high for the industry standard of 32%(+/- 1%). This apparently caused so much crystallization in the system that I had to have a new pump, injector, hose and a thorough DEF tank scrub all after less than 2 hrs of driving with the "bad fluid" in the tank. I was told that it was my fault for using bad fluid and that nothing would be covered under warranty.
So I contacted Peak Blue and asked for their batch testing results. They came back stating that the fluid is 2 weeks old and their fluid is at 31.3% and that there is no way that it could have gone up that high in that short amount of time.
Chrysler care was next, I provided the testing info and documentation supporting injectors going bad and catalytic converter problems as root cause from multiple sources even chrysler certified repair dealerships. Chrysler came back and said "the dealership has tested the fluid and you are still liable for repairs".
So $2900 later I have my jeep back. I am still in shock as to how this isnt covered especially since it is a known problem and many of you have had the same thing happen but it was a warranty repair.
So what to do now? I am at a loss and really need some support.
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Story time:
My JGC has 17k miles on it. Recently I purchased 5 gallons of Peak blue DEF from auto zone and put it in the DEF tank. After about 5 miles of driving I got the message that I used the wrong fluid. Now how could I have put the wrong fluid in I thought...It is the same fluid that I have used all along Even when I had to fill the tank from empty when I bought the vehicle new.
So my trip to the dealership starts and my adventure begins:
The first thing they did was test the fluid. It came out at 35% with their tools which is high for the industry standard of 32%(+/- 1%). This apparently caused so much crystallization in the system that I had to have a new pump, injector, hose and a thorough DEF tank scrub all after less than 2 hrs of driving with the "bad fluid" in the tank. I was told that it was my fault for using bad fluid and that nothing would be covered under warranty.
So I contacted Peak Blue and asked for their batch testing results. They came back stating that the fluid is 2 weeks old and their fluid is at 31.3% and that there is no way that it could have gone up that high in that short amount of time.
Chrysler care was next, I provided the testing info and documentation supporting injectors going bad and catalytic converter problems as root cause from multiple sources even chrysler certified repair dealerships. Chrysler came back and said "the dealership has tested the fluid and you are still liable for repairs".
So $2900 later I have my jeep back. I am still in shock as to how this isnt covered especially since it is a known problem and many of you have had the same thing happen but it was a warranty repair.
So what to do now? I am at a loss and really need some support.
1 - 20 of 32 Posts
This is why I have me Jeep dealer fill the DEF at all times. I don't fill it elsewhere. My current issue is that they've discovered that the DEF they used may have had a stale shelf life.
I just buy the Mopar stuff at the dealership. I can't see any reason to use anything else considering the problems people have reported. These vehicles are significant investments, so why try to save a few bucks on DEF? Just my opinion, but I also keep the receipt from every diesel fill up just in case I have a problem and Chrysler says I bought bad fuel. Maybe I'm over cautious.
I figure that I use less than a gallon of DEF a month. So the most I could save is about five bucks a month.... Why bother.
I am more concerned with the age of the DEF in the tank. Unfortunately I recently got a "Will not start in 200 mile warning" and when the service dept cleared it they topped of the tank with fresh DEF. (at no charge). My vehicle was waiting for a new cat which has since been replaced. But I stopped getting CEL's after the fresh DEF was added. I'm thinking that the marginal cat with old DEF might be why the problem started after 8k or so miles. My game plan now is to wait about 2500 miles and add one gallon of fresh.... then repeat until I'm down to 1/4 tank. That way I should be able to keep the DEF in the tank reasonably fresh.
I use high volume pumps for my Diesel..... I had also considered adding a fuel additive..... but decided against because that might raise questions if I have engine problems.
The service department has to meet conditions set by Chrysler or they won't get paid....... I want to make their life as easy as possible. It just makes sense.
I love my vehicle... a 4x2 limited with Bridgstone Blizzak snow tires (I think cooper makes some that are just as good). I got them from Costco so they will change them back for twenty bucks in the spring. The tires and 2 two sixty pound tubes of sand in the back with a short handled shovel have been handling these back to back storms we have been getting. There are a couple of hills around that are steep enough so that they just need be avoided. with hard packed snow/ice going up my 2wd can handle it. Going down not so hot.... more like a sled ride, The towns between my home and the mall I work at seem to be under the impression that if God Put it there Got will take it away. No sand or salt and barely plowed.
The whether tech mats are worth there weight in gold. and I am considering adding a winch and lights to the front.
I am patiently waiting for global warming........... I was promised it and I want it,
I am more concerned with the age of the DEF in the tank. Unfortunately I recently got a "Will not start in 200 mile warning" and when the service dept cleared it they topped of the tank with fresh DEF. (at no charge). My vehicle was waiting for a new cat which has since been replaced. But I stopped getting CEL's after the fresh DEF was added. I'm thinking that the marginal cat with old DEF might be why the problem started after 8k or so miles. My game plan now is to wait about 2500 miles and add one gallon of fresh.... then repeat until I'm down to 1/4 tank. That way I should be able to keep the DEF in the tank reasonably fresh.
I use high volume pumps for my Diesel..... I had also considered adding a fuel additive..... but decided against because that might raise questions if I have engine problems.
The service department has to meet conditions set by Chrysler or they won't get paid....... I want to make their life as easy as possible. It just makes sense.
I love my vehicle... a 4x2 limited with Bridgstone Blizzak snow tires (I think cooper makes some that are just as good). I got them from Costco so they will change them back for twenty bucks in the spring. The tires and 2 two sixty pound tubes of sand in the back with a short handled shovel have been handling these back to back storms we have been getting. There are a couple of hills around that are steep enough so that they just need be avoided. with hard packed snow/ice going up my 2wd can handle it. Going down not so hot.... more like a sled ride, The towns between my home and the mall I work at seem to be under the impression that if God Put it there Got will take it away. No sand or salt and barely plowed.
The whether tech mats are worth there weight in gold. and I am considering adding a winch and lights to the front.
I am patiently waiting for global warming........... I was promised it and I want it,
That's a good DEF strategy. I might do the same. I also avoid additives for the same reason. If the Chrysler doesn't require it then I'm not going to add it.I figure that I use less than a gallon of DEF a month. So the most I could save is about five bucks a month.... Why bother.
I am more concerned with the age of the DEF in the tank. Unfortunately I recently got a "Will not start in 200 mile warning" and when the service dept cleared it they topped of the tank with fresh DEF. (at no charge). My vehicle was waiting for a new cat which has since been replaced. But I stopped getting CEL's after the fresh DEF was added. I'm thinking that the marginal cat with old DEF might be why the problem started after 8k or so miles. My game plan now is to wait about 2500 miles and add one gallon of fresh.... then repeat until I'm down to 1/4 tank. That way I should be able to keep the DEF in the tank reasonably fresh.
I use high volume pumps for my Diesel..... I had also considered adding a fuel additive..... but decided against because that might raise questions if I have engine problems.
The service department has to meet conditions set by Chrysler or they won't get paid....... I want to make their life as easy as possible. It just makes sense.
I love my vehicle... a 4x2 limited with Bridgstone Blizzak snow tires (I think cooper makes some that are just as good). I got them from Costco so they will change them back for twenty bucks in the spring. The tires and 2 two sixty pound tubes of sand in the back with a short handled shovel have been handling these back to back storms we have been getting. There are a couple of hills around that are steep enough so that they just need be avoided. with hard packed snow/ice going up my 2wd can handle it. Going down not so hot.... more like a sled ride, The towns between my home and the mall I work at seem to be under the impression that if God Put it there Got will take it away. No sand or salt and barely plowed.
The whether tech mats are worth there weight in gold. and I am considering adding a winch and lights to the front.
I am patiently waiting for global warming........... I was promised it and I want it,
I'm also a fan of WeatherTech mats. I just had front, rear, and cargo set delivered a few weeks ago. I had them on my previous vehicles, as well. Nothing keeps the carpet looking new like these mats, and Michigan winters with all the salt can really ruin carpets quickly.
My father bought me weatherTech's for my birthday....well worth the money! The fit is insane.
Our 2014 JGC has been in the dealer 3 times for DEF system problems and I have always bought the fluid from the dealer. It is getting very frustrating when you get it back put 75 miles on it and it goes into wrong DEF detected again. It has had every DEF part on it replaced in its 17K life and now its doing it again. Wonder when lemon laws take effect? I spent nearly $50K on this thing for the economy and now its turning into a nightmare!
Take it to the dealer and tell them it's time for a new cat.
So something similar happened to me. Dealer said that DEF was bad and to flush and re-fill would be on my dime.
Luckily for me, the last fill of DEF was by another Dealership and they were able to show me that they were the ones that had filled the DEF last with MOPAR DEF. Even then, Chrysler still stated that it was my responsibility and that I would still be on the hook for the repairs (even though we all know it is a converter issue).
I held out for a very long time before I conceded that I was a lawyer.. .... They flushed and re-filed on their dime..
Luckily for me, the last fill of DEF was by another Dealership and they were able to show me that they were the ones that had filled the DEF last with MOPAR DEF. Even then, Chrysler still stated that it was my responsibility and that I would still be on the hook for the repairs (even though we all know it is a converter issue).
I held out for a very long time before I conceded that I was a lawyer.. .... They flushed and re-filed on their dime..
After reading all the DEF horror stories it sounds like it is time for a class action lawsuit. I had the issue at 7k miles but the BlueDef I ran through it was fine when they tested it. Since the I switched to TerraCair which is supposed to be what Chrysler uses but am scared to even put the crap in the DEF tank.
If you read on the Ram diesel forums most of those guys are using DEF purchased at truck stops.
The owners manual says ISO22241 certified. How can they charge you for this?
If you read about DEF it says it has a 2 year shelf life.
The owners manual says ISO22241 certified. How can they charge you for this?
If you read about DEF it says it has a 2 year shelf life.
2yrs if stored within the temperature range and out of direct sunlight. There should be a date on all DEF with when it was manufactured. I picked up 7-2.5 gallon jugs this past week that were all made in November.
My 2014 Jeep started having DEF problems at 22k. It started with a regen message but I couldn’t get the vehicle to regen so I had to take it to the dealership. Then the following happened:
1. Check engine light came on – the dealership rebooted my system (~23k)
2. Check engine light came on – the dealership updated my system (~23.5k)
3. Check engine light came on then shut off - the dealership did nothing (~24k)
4. Check engine light came on – the dealership updated my system (~25k)
5. Check engine light came on – the dealership unclogged the DEF system (~26k)
6. Check engine light came on – the dealership changed the NOX sensor (~27k)
7. Check engine light came on – the dealership changed the cat convertor (~28k)
8. The vehicle wouldn’t start – the dealership towed the Jeep and reset the system
a. They said it was a combo of low fuel in tank (100 miles left in tank), oil change needed soon and 500 miles till DEF ran out. I guess all these alerts went off at once and tripped the system.
Every time I call Jeep Customer Care and have a case logged. Customer Care has given me free oil changes for 2yrs and reimbursed me for a car payment. They won’t buy back the vehicle but have offered me 5% off a new vehicle if I wanted to trade this one in.
My Advice to you:
1. Call Jeep Customer Care every time you have a problem
2. Have Jeep fill your DEF fluid
3. Figure out when a good time to trade the vehicle in so that you take a minimal loss
The vehicle is great but the DEF system is crap. Too bad Jeep decided to make the vehicle 50 state admissions compliant because without this system it would be a great vehicle.
1. Check engine light came on – the dealership rebooted my system (~23k)
2. Check engine light came on – the dealership updated my system (~23.5k)
3. Check engine light came on then shut off - the dealership did nothing (~24k)
4. Check engine light came on – the dealership updated my system (~25k)
5. Check engine light came on – the dealership unclogged the DEF system (~26k)
6. Check engine light came on – the dealership changed the NOX sensor (~27k)
7. Check engine light came on – the dealership changed the cat convertor (~28k)
8. The vehicle wouldn’t start – the dealership towed the Jeep and reset the system
a. They said it was a combo of low fuel in tank (100 miles left in tank), oil change needed soon and 500 miles till DEF ran out. I guess all these alerts went off at once and tripped the system.
Every time I call Jeep Customer Care and have a case logged. Customer Care has given me free oil changes for 2yrs and reimbursed me for a car payment. They won’t buy back the vehicle but have offered me 5% off a new vehicle if I wanted to trade this one in.
My Advice to you:
1. Call Jeep Customer Care every time you have a problem
2. Have Jeep fill your DEF fluid
3. Figure out when a good time to trade the vehicle in so that you take a minimal loss
The vehicle is great but the DEF system is crap. Too bad Jeep decided to make the vehicle 50 state admissions compliant because without this system it would be a great vehicle.
Had the check engine light come on shortly after a Jeep Dealer serviced our 2014 JGC Diesel. Took it back to Jeep Dealer who told me after a diagnostic check that the DEF was contaminated. Told us that the DEF would have to be pumped out, DEF tank sanitized w/a detergent, and re-filled. Said I caused the contamination problem by not replacing the cap on the DEF tank filler port. Advised them that there was no cap, never had a ca[, and that's how they delivered it to us. Checked with other Jeep Dealerships who told me the vehicle does not come with one. The Jeep dealership where the vehicle is right now (since 02-13-15) said the clean out will be at my cost..$800.00.
Contacted Jeep directly and confirmed that the 2014 JGC Diesel does NOT come with a DEF filler port cap. They assigned a case number on 02-16-15 and told us we will here from a Jeep Rep within one day. I can say that at this point I was pleased with the way the Jeep Customer Care rep listened to my problem and concern about paying for a repair that I did not cause. The DEF tank has never been completely full. Waiting to see the outcome from this. BTW another Jeep Dealer closer to me than the one I have my vehicle at presently told me he has 2 cases of 2014 JGC Diesels that have the same DEF/Injector codes coming up and is working with Jeep to try and resolve the problem. As he told me the one code indicating a clogged injector can be a $2-3 K repair. The dealer told me that both customers are really upset. That dealer also told me he did not want to take on my DEF/check engine problem until he had these two cases resolved. That makes sense. Both Jeep dealers that I had my vehicle serviced at are located in North New Jersey. The dealers that I contacted to question if the 2014 JGC Diesel comes with a DEF tank filler cap were also located in N NJ.
I am pleased with my jeep so far except that the electronic shifter takes some getting used to. I suspect that this DEF contamination/injector/repair stuff will end up with Jeep sending out a recall or worse perhaps a class action lawsuit. Best thing we can do right now is save receipts, take photos and spread the word regarding these problems and resolutions.
I would hope that as an American Company Jeep and its parent company will be moved to do the right thing for everyone that has legitimate problems with their diesels. My two previous diesels were VW's and I was VERY happy with those vehicles. I just wanted to try a domestically produced diesel vehicle. I'll update as we learn more.
Contacted Jeep directly and confirmed that the 2014 JGC Diesel does NOT come with a DEF filler port cap. They assigned a case number on 02-16-15 and told us we will here from a Jeep Rep within one day. I can say that at this point I was pleased with the way the Jeep Customer Care rep listened to my problem and concern about paying for a repair that I did not cause. The DEF tank has never been completely full. Waiting to see the outcome from this. BTW another Jeep Dealer closer to me than the one I have my vehicle at presently told me he has 2 cases of 2014 JGC Diesels that have the same DEF/Injector codes coming up and is working with Jeep to try and resolve the problem. As he told me the one code indicating a clogged injector can be a $2-3 K repair. The dealer told me that both customers are really upset. That dealer also told me he did not want to take on my DEF/check engine problem until he had these two cases resolved. That makes sense. Both Jeep dealers that I had my vehicle serviced at are located in North New Jersey. The dealers that I contacted to question if the 2014 JGC Diesel comes with a DEF tank filler cap were also located in N NJ.
I am pleased with my jeep so far except that the electronic shifter takes some getting used to. I suspect that this DEF contamination/injector/repair stuff will end up with Jeep sending out a recall or worse perhaps a class action lawsuit. Best thing we can do right now is save receipts, take photos and spread the word regarding these problems and resolutions.
I would hope that as an American Company Jeep and its parent company will be moved to do the right thing for everyone that has legitimate problems with their diesels. My two previous diesels were VW's and I was VERY happy with those vehicles. I just wanted to try a domestically produced diesel vehicle. I'll update as we learn more.
Don't know where the dealer gets his info. My DEF tank came with a cap and has one currently. It's the DIESEL filler neck which is not capped and always open.
Thanks for the update. Just wondering if your vehicle is a 2014 or a different year? The Jeep factory and several dealers in the area told me the 2014's did NOT come with a filler cap on the DEF filler port. Thanks for the info.Don't know where the dealer gets his info. My DEF tank came with a cap and has one currently. It's the DIESEL filler neck which is not capped and always open.
My 2014 has a DEF cap. You can't let contaminants in there, so there's gotta be a cap.Thanks for the update. Just wondering if your vehicle is a 2014 or a different year? The Jeep factory and several dealers in the area told me the 2014's did NOT come with a filler cap on the DEF filler port. Thanks for the info.
Mine is a 2014....... I remember back when I was researching the vehicle. I looked at them both on car lots and images on line. I have never seen an image or vehicle without a cap. I am drawing up short of saying a cap-less one would be because some one removed it and did not put it back..... but not by much.
i have a 2014. The DEF does have a cap. Diesel fuel input does not. Fortunately I have not had ANY problems with my GC. 25K milesThanks for the update. Just wondering if your vehicle is a 2014 or a different year? The Jeep factory and several dealers in the area told me the 2014's did NOT come with a filler cap on the DEF filler port. Thanks for the info.
1 - 20 of 32 Posts
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